a friend of mine, who happens to be a full blood showed this term to me on one of the "indian social network sites".... i decided to read the "posts" and replies to see what they were talking about and what this term actually meant. I realized that the people using this term where saying that those indians with black hair.... dark eyes....and a darker shade of skin were what those of non indian and those that could not prove they were indian, called those that looked indian. I found this amusing.... since most full bloods ... and many 1/2 breeds fit this description.

But wait .... now i am not paley white....altho i am fair skinned .... my hair in younger days was also lite .... in summer my skin turns darker just from the heat.... and my hair just turns more grey .... yet i have never considered anyone that told me they were indian that they were a "hollywood" indian just because they were darker then me or thier hair darker then mine .... sssssssssooooooooooooo

upon further investigation, I found that those that refused to speak or research thier heritage and culture used this term quite often.... kinda funny to me... this is like saying that a white person is more indian then a full blood. Or that I can not prove i am indian because my house burned down and now there is no record.

as simple minded as this sounds.... i hope that the indians on this site will speak up and show people that use these terms or exscuses how silly they sound .... to participate in this type of activity only involves you in the genocide of our languages...our cultures and our traditions.

As L/D/N people, we all have a role that we play in helping our people and our Nation.... weather it is leagal issues... treaty rights ... language .... or even helping those that have been told they are indian, find thier heritage and thier people.... in the end, we need to work for our Nations so that our people may live.

Never heard of that term before I am content just being the half breed prairie nigger or wagon burner or one of those .....Pause.....people. Don't really want or need more adjectives. Of course the red half have some interesting terms for us mixed bloods as well...............

while the worst name i have been called by full bloods is "iyeska" .... and they use that as a derogatory term...i remind them that this term literally means "to speak white".... while english unfortunately is my first language i tolerate it. But as I stated in many posts before this one... we all may not agree with what one another say, so as L/D/N people we must just respect that and, state our views and move on..... but we do not have to tolerate the continueing "cultural genocide" by anyone.

Many times, we as L/D/N people face extreme prejudice from with in our own nation due to misunderstandings and not knowing. Our culture, traditions, way of everyday life...language , ceremony, and relationship terms have been corrupted and defiled from those not of our people. These are things we must correct and continue to teach others that are from our Nation ... no matter if they are full blood or mix bloods. Dominant society created this division back in the 1800's and now those of new age beliefs continue to create more havoc by telling people that language and culture is not important because we are all of one race. The bottom line is this... we were all given a language... we were all given specific ceremonies....and we were all given a way to live by the powers that be for a reason.... we speak and live as a nation ....L/D/N .... because when we live and speak as a Nation ... it helps our people and it strengthens our nation.

pila for answering this post....toksa ake

I take it all pretty much as a compliment I knew when I moved to a county with .02% non white population it was going to be fat toothless hillbilly central. I grew a pretty thick skin as a kid in a very similiar setting. LOL when you are enrolled in a small town school as a American Indian with 26 classmates who all worship John Wayne there is not much choice.
The adults of today are just as bad and I still see them just as much fools as the children of 35 years ago or so. Amazing though after I was adopted I got a brand new Birth Certificate and instantly became white and was treated much different when my Race by some powerful magic changed. (The if you can pass for white be white phase of my life) What can I say I was a scared kid and knew It would be a long long time if ever before I went back home. Now I am moving too fast toward getting old and not much of anything scares me anymore, in particular words from idiots.
I keep hoping someday to return home for more than a week long visit. I find myself bound very much though to this piece of dirt I live on and the life it makes possible for me. So I will be the local Wagon Burner and let the locals believe just enough of the stories about the savege in me is true to keep them at arms length.
At least one person of indiginous descent lives here where human beings once called home...the Miami, the Shawnee, and forgotten ones who lived and honored the land and their relatives right here. I am reminded thatus wagon burners were here on this land long before my white half anscestors came, every time I find a arrow head or a stone tool and wonder about the man or woman that made it used it and lost it so that 200years 1000 years or 40000 years later I could bend to down and remember them and thank that unkown person for leaving something so simple behind, yet something that transfers so much wonder, appreciation, and history.
Yes Wagon Burner is indeed a compliment.

Have you ever heard the term copper head? People call my buddy that a lot of times. Cool guy, stays to him self a lot, but smart kid. I don't know if copper head is a new slang term or an old offensive one ......

All I am certain of is that ladies prefer the AmeriCan Red Snake 99-1 over the European white snake (Take that with humor in which it is intended)

Lol, I'm not white no harm done. I'm packin' a black cobra so I'm fine. Interesting post though, never knew there was such a term as Hollywood Indians. White people make like 8 derogatory names for one race.

Since people of any race began meeting and interacting with other races the name calling started. Thinking of all the names whites have for each other based on geography, ethnicity, and just about any other factor its no wonder there are so many colorful names given to the brown, bronze, black, red, yellow, and somewhere in between people.
Personally I don't get to worked up over the names. The intent behind the naming is another matter. Is it ignorance, joking, hate, or just plain pointing out the differences in order to maintain division rather than focusing on what we share in common.
I think people in general like the division and the controversy. I know Government types love division. It makes for good politics and keeps a sore festering and infected. It creates nonsense like the Proffessor and the Cop having a beer summit at the white house where a Government type can get press and kudos in the division.
I do notice the real issues behind the names are never really spoken of but are always encouraged from all sides. The names are harmless in and of themselves it is the intent and actions behind the names that are so devastating. In my opinion.

i dont play cowboys and indians to good, my game is cops and robbers Peace

When you put things like that, it starts to make sense. One question though, you mention that there is an intent and purpose behind the names? If you could please clarify, I am a bit naive of this other than the basic generics like hate and separation. What would you say is the purpose and intent of these names and racial tension? And what are the real issues behind the names? You said it in your statement; I was a bit confuzzled and trying to understand your point. That's all.

Sincerely,

Walli

It just seems to me the more divisions that can be exploited between groups and individuals the better other individuals and groups do. It always seems that for every positive step forward people make there are others who refocus the attention on a division making the entire effort of the positive steps meaningless.
One person I find always at the center of some controversy is Jesse Jackson, I don't believe the man cares even a little bit about things getting better. He is a race huslter that has built a fortune through keeping people seperate and in turmoil. At the end of the day I think Jesse is the Whitest Black man I have ever seen. I use him only as a example there are plenty of others out there that only find their outrage when the is cash or political profit to be won.
Keeping individuals and groups seperated in what should be a common interest is a age old control mechanism of all succesful regimes. It keeps people from forming a large consensus that they are getting the shaft from the regime. It further allows the regime to redirect anger at it to a individual or group as being the bad guy.
Lets face it right now the Mexicans are the bad people as are Arabs. The powers that be make political profit from the Mexicans and Natural resource profits from the Arabic people, while having the support of the home individuals and groups who already are well divided but under enough control to be united to fend off the hordes of illegal aliens and Islamic terrorist.
So the names began River Surfers, Sand Niggers, Camel Jockey, Greaser etc. The intent behind the names is the first step in shaping opinions of the new enemy, it dehumanizes the people and makes it easier to target them for wars, sanctions, or Nation building in the image that best serves the interest of the elite in a regime.
History teaches us that it is easy to kill tribal people if they are first portrayed as less than human and that by killing them their lives can then be made better. It is far Easier to keep a black slave if the entire black race is viewed as something less than human so the same basic birth rights given to a human can be denied because well that race is sub human. Even whites who are not the right kind of white are subject to being dehumanized. The Irish in America were veiwed as something much less than human.
We play along well in the division, just the way I see things

Thanks for the explanation StormsRider, it has made what you said previously a lot clearer to me. The discovery of the Americas messed everything up. It was the discovery of the Americas the justified the extermination of countless native tribes and peoples, and then it went a step further to dehumanize black Africans in order to have a steady slave supply. Whites refused to work the low and poor wages. Even the Slavs to the east who had for a long time been the steady supply of slaves. Slavs proved to be too rebellious and coordinated, so they conquered several tribes of blacks who spoke many different languages. The process of colonization intensely destroyed so many cultures, and the ONLY way to heal this world is to reverse all practices of colonization. Including the dehumanization of other humans. Others HAD to be dehumanized, because if they did not it would've made the colonization or enslavement of others wrong. The same can be said about the natives in the Pacific Ocean. There is a plethora of evidence suggesting this. But I sometimes become confused about how all this can be actually done.

I like many people hope for a collapse, I think in that moment the world will get a fresh start to redo things over in a viable and fair manner. The era ending the sins of 1492 is near. I hope in my heart that all peoples including the Lakotah get a fresh start to do what they feel is right.

You know Storm Rider; I've reevaluated the statements both you and I made previously. I think I've had to think long and hard, but I do agree with you. Blacks do have political freedoms, more than natives will ever have as long as America stands. However, there is one thing that both our people and all other indigenous people have in common. Slavery is no longer measured by the political freedoms of a people but by the economic and cultural bondage they are held in. The truth is that human rights are not given by the constitution.

There are several rights which are neglected and will never be acknowledge. I have recently read something called: The Three Generations of Human Rights. In this document by a Czech jurist it details the rights of individuals based on political, economic, and socio-cultural rights. However, I personally add another right, the right to good health and the good health of nature. Natives are denied economic development, and denied the rights to practice their culture. This is the modern tool of slavery... And yes I too agree that Jesse Jackson is a poser and not a true man of civil rights.

Natives are denied human rights and the only way to break the bondage in my opinion is to break the cycle of economic dependence and restore ancient cultures.

I have been technologically challenged the past few month and could only read post on my phone. This thread reminded me of when I went to the Cherokee Rez in NC/TN. I dont remember the year, but when we returned home OJ was doing his slow speed chase.

Anyhow, in the tourist part of the rez there were "indians" standing in front of the stores to pose for pictures. What struck me as funny, odd or however you want to describe it, but these "Cherokee Indians" were wearing painted full, flowing war bonnets. I could be wrong but I believe the big war bonnets came about around the mid 1800's on the plains.

After being on this board, I began to wonder if they, the Cherokee, were just playing to the tourist, or did they not know their own histories. I have read and seen many old documents with etchings and drawings of the Cherokee from the 1600's and 1700's. Nearly every image, the warriors wore either a few feathers or a turbin like covering. No wonder ignorant whites have such crazy ideas about the native peoples.

To me, it only backs up NDN's assertions that the L,D,N and all First Nations must teach their culture, language, and religions to their youth, and any members of their particular nations who want to learn.

Keep up the good work NDN

ty for your words of encouragement .... as for the Cherokee rez in NC ... they do know thier culture .... but yet they know dominant society believes this is how all indians dressed at one time. I have seen many indians protest outside ball parks complaining about the name of a team .... yet, many times such as the Cherokee have shown, indians partake in the exact same cultural genocide. These myths must be met head on by our people to show dominant society that we are many Nations with our own traditions, our own way of life and our own languages. While our future is very important to our survival, sometimes we must stop to see where we came from so we can move forward.

Hmmm, does this quest for reconnection with ones past eliminate the dreams and aspirations of men like Tecumseh? One thing I liked about Tecumseh is that he knew that one tribe could not do it alone. I know there are a lot of negative ideas against Pan-Indian movements. I my self am against new age movements. But the idea that all tribes strengthen one another is this idea gone? Is it dead?

To prevent misunderstanding, I will give an explanation of what I mean. I am in full support of all tribes relearning their languages and connecting with the ways of their ancestors. I believe that it is one important part of recovery. A lost people with no language and culture are not a people at all. Look at my own people; we are in constant conflict with each other. Native Americans have what we don't, a culture and a language. But I my primary concern is that most native tribes are so small that they will make almost little or no impact what so ever on the American political landscape. Besides the occasional media attention and lip service given to the natives, the indigenous plight is almost totally unheard of in America. There are so few Natives that you are out of sight and out of mind. I personally think that increasing your populations and working with closely related tribes in federations is the only way that the voice of the indigenous will be heard.

Forgive me if these words seem disrespectful or against your culture wishes, however, my concerns are valid. Unlike my people who number in the tens of millions, the indigenous number in the hundreds of thousands, maybe as high as one or two million. This is not nearly enough for self-defense or mutual protection of any way of life.

There has to be a population boom if there is to be any hope of progress towards your cause. This does not mean there have to be hundreds of millions of natives, but rather, there must be something close to 30-40 million natives to actually have a large enough population to do anything. This means Natives in across the whole of Anglo-America (Canada and the United States) including the Lakotah must number somewhere around 30-40 million to do basic task and maintain an adequate population which can protect the lands. This is not much larger than the 21 million natives that existed on these lands before Columbus.

To further my point, even if America does collapse, which it will, you are faced with many threats, most white populations of these lands will volunteer to leave and will fight you for this land. I know your people are warriors, this alone commends respect and admiration, but they will eternally take the lands and use absolute force to have their way. Regardless to if America is one whole country or a series of smaller ones. The only way to have a safe and prosperous land is to crush those whites who will not leave as the natives do and force them into a state of exile. Only then will your people have peace. There are also other threats like Russia, China, and a plethora of other groups who wish to retake these lands. These threats maybe real or imagined, but I would never take a chance and say that it is not a possibility.

It has become evident in my personal opinion that there can never be true peace between the vast majority of Eurasian Civilizations and the indigenous ways of life. Their way of life is destructive, greedy, and against the common good of their people. It focuses too much on individuals and individual greed. But without an adequate population of people who will create schools, defend your people, and farm your lands? How will you accomplish your dreams? How can you protect your selves when you have little people to defend what is precious to you?

This idea of a federation will not call for the elimination or resignation of cultures and or languages, but will protect the common defense and rights of all tribes. One tribe CAN NOT do this alone. This task is just too large to be done by one’s self. Remember, that colonization happened not because one European country colonized these lands, but because the ENTIRE continent put their all into colonizing this continent. Please remember this when you make your considerations.

I am merely listing my concerns, which I consider to be legitimate to the success or failure of many indigenous revivals. Please take my words with serious consideration, and I beg you to bring these issues to your elders. These words must not be unheard.

Is this human being one who is described in the thread title?Just curious to hear from those who have an interest in such things.

Someone said: "fat, toothless hillbilly central." That made me laugh as the joke is: "why was the toothbrush invented in Arkansas?" well if invented anywhere else, it would be a teeth-brush...

War bonnets on Cherokee? they usually wore turbans...
reminds me of the stand up doll with GI joe in the 60's called "Chief Cherokee" with a war-bonnet.
LOL